Misinformation, the Internet and the Golden Dawn

Well, I guess the truth is out there – the Internet has spoken. I have to come clean.

Click to enlarge

Yes, it’s true – I ‘fit with’ Nick Farrell, which means, yes, those trolls on Amazon trashing Nick’s book were obviously right – I simply parrot him. However, even more outstanding, the Internet has revealed a true image of me, and yes, I have to admit it – I AM PROFESSOR RONALD HUTTON. 🙂

Don’t you love the Internet?

Wiser folk than I have commented on the way the Internet screw things up. And on how it is wonderful fodder for the paranoid mind – both to be deceived and to deceive others. Now, while I would love to have the intelligence, acumen, access to primary resources and academic credentials of Prof Hutton, this misidentification is the result of a robot. Other more nefarious and conscious cases of misidentify have recently taken place in the Golden Dawn community. I am talking of David Griffin’s recent post claiming Nick Farrell is secret mole for Fundamentalist Christianity intent on destroying the Golden Dawn from within. Gosh. Wow. Jeepers. Pass the ginger beer.

On MOTO I have always tried to be polite and balanced, even when to paraphrase Mr Crowley, “contemplating the idiocy of these louts”. In fact Pat Zalewski, when commenting on the newly published By Names and Images, paid me a nice compliment when he said, “I have never known the man to blow his cool online.” However, this latest round of weirdness has got me on edge.

Of course, the standard advice from most folk is simply to ignore the likes of David Griffin, and eventually they’ll go away. Maybe so, maybe no. With his latest few missives David has shown himself to be a few olives short of a pizza. So, maybe we should not react too vigorously to his paranoia?

However, in the meantime the Golden Dawn looks likes it’s run by clowns having a bad acid trip. I don’t like that. I don’t like the fact that I have to warn people away from the Internet when they want to know about the Golden Dawn. I think there needs to be a counter balance for the ridiculous things out there, not just those by David. A countering of misinformation with information. I think this needs to be done on several forums by the whole community, calmly and sensibly without personal rancour and attacks. Hopefully then those approaching the GD and magic online will see the real and the silly, and make up their own minds.

With regards to David’s assertion that Nick Farrell is a secret fundie mole, I immediately thought of an episode of Seinfeld where the owner of a cobblers shop (‘mom and pop’) disappear overnight with a bunch of Jerry’s shoes. Kramer, ever the paranoid, thinks this was their plan all along.  Elaine responds:

So. Mom and Pop’s plan was to move into the neighborhood…establish trust…for 48 years. And then, run off with Jerry’s sneakers.

So. Nick’s plan was to move to England, train for decades, research and write several books, start an international magical Order. And then tell us we’re all going to burn in hell.

See how stupid it is? Why a spiritual leader would think or suggest something like this is beyond me (Morgan has a go at analysis on his blog). Whatever the reason, it can’t be good – for him, his Order or the Golden Dawn as a whole.

PS: the image came from a search by my son, Googling his now-author father. 🙂

28 comments

  1. FS · March 30, 2012

    Hahaha, totally love that pic. You are looking great these days Prof Perregin… I also agree with your idea, I honestly can’t believe how far this has all gone.

  2. Mike · March 30, 2012

    I think a lot of Golden Dawn initiates go through some pretty harrowing times. We often show our love for the system but not a lot of the hell we might go through as we go through it. If we don’t heed the warning of ego inflation and always be on guard for it, it just doesn’t seem that far of a stretch for things to go very, very wrong.

  3. Mike Howard · March 30, 2012

    I knew all along that you were Professor Hutton – that is why you have never been seen together in the same room. I really enjoyed your book ‘Truimph of the Moon. Are you planning a follow up soon?
    Thanks also for giving my book ‘Children of Cain’ such a good recommendation. 🙂

    Seriously, I got a review copy of your book from Skylight. It is an excellent work and a fine contribution to Golden Dawn literature from somebody who is obviously a serious practioner of the Arte Magical.

    Mike H.

  4. Peregrin · March 30, 2012

    @ Fr FS – no, I can’t believe how far it has gone 😦

    @ Mike – yes, ego inflation is always a lurking possibility. ‘Constant vigilance!’ as Prof Moody would say 🙂 Thanks.

    @Mike H – Thanks, Mike, such a comment coming from a deep elder of our traditions, such as yourself, is high praise indeed. Will need to renew my sub to the Cauldron and watch out for the review 🙂 Thanks.

  5. Mike Howard · March 30, 2012

    Talking about cases of mistaken identity and the Internet some may find the following story amusing. I was e-mailed by somebody who said that they had been contacted in a dream by the late Andrew D.Chumbley, former Magister of the Cultus Sabbati. I did not regard that as an impossibility, but I asked this person how they knew it was Chumbley. They replied that he looked exactly as he did in his photograph on the Internet. As the Cultus has never released any photos of ADC I was intrigued and asked for the link. It turned out to be a website attacking the Cultus and indeed there was a photograph on it labelled ‘Andrew Chumbley’ – I don’t know who it was but unfortunately it wasn’t the Andrew Chumbley that I knew! Mike H.

  6. alexsumner · March 30, 2012

    It gets even sillier – Nick’s method of “infilitrating” the Golden Dawn consisted of him leaving it to found his own order.I wish certain other people would “infilitrate” the GD, though obviously not the order which NF left.

  7. alexsumner · March 30, 2012

    Oh dear the last sentence of my previous comment was supposed to be whited out for comic effect. 😉

  8. Fallen Adept · March 30, 2012

    The ironic thing is Griffin is making accusations that Nickis following the same path that led to the fall of the the EOGD and Robert Zink, the ironic part is nearly word for word of every blog, post and website Griffin puts out is exactly the same as what Zink did and caused his demise. The pot calling the kettle black comes to mind, also Highlander mentality. I don’t think you have to worry the more banter Dave puts out the bigger the hole he is pounding in his own ship, he’ll sink himself in time.

  9. Jarek Carnelian · March 31, 2012

    You guys just totally missed the point didn’t you? Come on, you are none of you stupid so quit the disingenuous nonsense.

    Farrell has been labelled as one using the very same methods and the very same arguments against the same targets – as are used over and over by Fundies. Did you not get that?

    This may be aimed at AO, and in fact there is no denying that either if you honestly read Farrell’s own blog – but the damage is to the WHOLE community, not just the AO, not just the GD, the entire Pagan Community…

    Farrell is doing the work of Christian Fundies for them, and that was the point of the article you are now all pretending not to have understood. Or was the humour really lost on you?

    Twisting this to suit your own short termist agenda is short sighted in the extreme – the damage we are ALL suffering will not be easy to recover from. Had Farrell been paid by the Fundies to attack us, the end result would have looked exactly the same. So please try to keep up with the plot!

  10. FS · March 31, 2012

    @Jarek, Nobody has missed the point here. People are just thinking with their minds rather than their mislead hearts. The only damage being done is coming from the direction you work in, done towards a mans hard work by writing false reviews about his work in order to deliberately mislead people. Lying to discredit a persons work in order to put him out of wallet should not be a part of a spiritual path, its just plain wrong.

    Also Nick as a Christian Fundie? Where on earth did that come from? Why don’t you email those Christian Fundies at their site and ask “Hey excuse me, do you guys perchance also run a magical order, having spent many years of your life training in order to gain the knowledge to do such a thing? Oh also are you Nick Farrell?”. Use your gray matter instead of your emotional attachment mate, you’ve been mislead.

  11. FS · March 31, 2012

    p.s excuse my spelling 🙂

  12. S.V. · March 31, 2012

    Mr. Griffin requested that a review be given of the book, based upon the disparaging and false material contained in its Introduction, which associates the HOGD/A+O by clear implication with other unidentifed “personality cult” orders that Farrell states were built by modern day “mythicians.”

    Any reasonable person who reads the Introduction to this book and has a smattering of knowledge about the HOGD/A+O (what can be Googled) can clearly see that Farrell, probably intentionally, left his identification of these “mythicians” very loose and vague, so as to allow the inference to be drawn by his readers that he indeed was including the HOGD/A+O in his negative assessment contained in his Introduction. I, too, am a writer. For Mr. Farrell, as a professional, to be so imprecise about a very charged subject constitutes either negligence or, more disturbingly, was derived from a calculated decision that would leave just enough room for a claim of plausable deniability if called out for the wrong that was done here.

    I, for one, do not find Mr. Farrell’s denials plausable.

    Therefore, contrary to your assertions, no one was asked to write a “false review” or to “[lie] to discredit a persons [sic] work…” The reviews are not designed to “deliberately mislead people,” as you wrongly allege. Instead, these reviews are being made in the form of a protest about intellectual dishonesty–based upon the Introduction to the book– and to inform readers to be cautious about what masquerades as an objective work of historical research that is in reality a politicaly motivated book written with a veiled agenda to promote magical orders like Mr. Farrell’s, by attempting to malign and discredit the HOGD/A+O.

  13. Samuel · April 1, 2012

    For those of us old enough to recall the Cold War era, there was this little thing known as Disinformation.

    What we have seen in recent years is not only misinformation, but disinformation flooding the Internet, especially from certain parties.

    The current disinformation, as is spouted about by S.V. is a prime example of the art. It is also a prime example of the oft repeated lie talking point which has become the rallying cry used by the Party, er, the “Order” that S.V. represents.

    No one is able to “malign” the HOGD/AO or to use their correct initials, HOGDOOROAO, quite as well as their very public and vocal leaders (and now members) can. They do this with every post of their particular “Party Line” arguments, their continued “talking points”, and their vitriolic and inflammatory language.

    Interesting how they accuse others of the very actions that they themselves are guilty of.

    Now it is fine to buy into a particular “Party Line” and to hold to that line in the face of evidence to the contrary. Merely repeating the same talking points over and over ad nauseum on the internet make them anymore true than the picture of Peregrin used in this blog. Misinformation, Disinformation, and certainly fabrication of information is something wherein Discernment and Discrimination must come into play.

    I personally believe that most people in the esoteric community, and particularly the Golden Dawn Community excel at the qualities of Discernment and Discrimination. They also excel at the qualities of Integrity and Responsibility.

    Unfortunately there are those few, those handful few, that do not possess these particular qualities at all. It is these few, these very vocal few, which truly ruin the reputation of the Golden Dawn name and the Tradition itself, whether they are in the Tradition or on the outside trying to tear down that Tradition.

    In LVX,
    Samuel

  14. Nick Farrell · April 1, 2012

    One of the things that really surprised me was the sort of comments by people like SV. I grew up in a house with a librarian and a frustrated author the value of books was drilled into me at an early age (I could read and write long before i got to school). So the idea of listening to someone who tells me to rubbish a book before I have read it would send alarm bells into my head.
    SV claims to be a writer and yet claims that an outsider should have the right to police a writer’s words. This is something re-enforced by another professed writer Fr Barnabas who has also firmly nailed his colours to that of Griffin. But a writer’s job is always to write what they see and feel and not give a monkeys if their words harm or hurt. A historian is supposed to interpret primary sources and not care too much if the truth harms some one’s ego or treasured false history. If someone does not like what they write that is their problem not that of the writers.
    The fact that Griffin has cherry picked sentences and presented them to members and said “he is saying this” obeys the first law of propaganda. That is “the first opinion you have of a subject is always difficult to shift”. So he manufactured a quote and told people “Farrell is saying this” since they have no idea who I am and have not read the book they have no chance of contradicting it and a bogus opinion was formed. Griffin had this advantage because he has managed to convince people that his A+O is the real AO and not a 1990s reconstruction based on the Slater manuscripts.
    This runs counter to King over the Water which looks at the AO whose time passed in the 1940s.
    It means that if I say completely truthfully that I did not write King over the Water about David Griffin’s group I will not be believed. All very clever control stuff but all something which can be unpicked by anyone who choose to think about it.
    What is perhaps tragic to those who are outside Griffin’s order is that ultimately such control tactics always fail. It may take five, ten or 20 years but people leave groups saying “well I learned a lot, but I wish I had not followed this person.” I believe that before people get stuck with such groups the universe gives them a word of warning. If they chose to ignore this warning then they get stuck in the story and cannot leave it. When Griffin piped up with his wacky conspiracy theory I thought I would ignore him. But my Imperator said that I had a responsibly to show people how he was doing it and what he was doing. Then they can make up their own mind.
    But I have not asked my group to put up reviews or do anything to counter Griffin’s trollish antics. Every post that has a heading “this book should be burnt” will send a chill wind down the spine of any intellectual out there and by their own words they condemn themselves.

  15. S.V. · April 1, 2012

    @Nick Farrell,

    Mr. Farrell, you miss my point entirely. I have absolutely no problem with a researcher writing the facts as they see them and coming to conclusions which are very unpopular to others for various reasons. It does not bother me one whit that you have come to the conclusion that the HOGD/A+O rests upon an illusory and/or false foundation. This was not my point. I, and those I think I speak for, understand that you believe you are correct in your research and conclusions. I also believe it is more than acceptable, even required, that you write what you believe to be true based upon your research.

    BUT, only if done honestly. I had a problem with your Introduction being what appears to be a purposeful confusion as to the identification of modern organizations that are “personality cults” led or started by “mythicians.” Clearly the HOGD/A+O is implicated in your Introduction, as you have been informed as of late by many that understood that. It is this purposefully unclear Introduction and your subsequent reaction to it that I call foul. To deny that others have perceived that your Introduction maligned them (by claiming Griffin’s quotation of your work was misleading) and then to state that you were not including by implication the HOGD/A+O in you identification of modern day “personality cults” in your Introduction, well that is where the dishonesty comes to play, in my opinion.

    Say what you mean and mean what you say, Mr. Farrell. Either your book is about a failed and historical AO that did not survive in any form to the present day, meaning that the present day HOGD/A+O claims to its lineages and transmissions are false, or it is not.

    Be honest. Own your words. You cannot have it both ways. This is the intellectual dishonesty that prompted me to get into this fray and to offer a voice of what I think is reason and critical thinking. I did not join these discussions because of the premise of your book being antithetical to the HOGD/A+O. This is not about censoring your opinion because it is unsavory.

    Your claim that you were not discussing the HOGD/A+O in your Introduction is only further belied by your latest above posting, wherein you state “Griffin had this advantage because he has managed to convince people that his A+O is the real AO and not a 1990s reconstruction based on the Slater manuscripts.” This statement by you clearly informs me that you indeed were discussing the HOGD/A+O in you Introduction and identifying it as a cult built by a mythician.

    You are entitled to your opinion, but don’t equivocate as you have been doing, please, it is demeaning. Own your work, Mr. Farrell and be honest. That was my point, not any disagreement with the veracity of the body of your work.

  16. Nick Farrell · April 2, 2012

    It seems to me SV that until you have read the book yourself you cant make any judgments about its contents

  17. S.V. · April 2, 2012

    @Samuel,

    You are way off base. There are no talking points or disinformation in my posts. I am working solo here and not under the direction of any person. Please see my response to Mr. Farrell to understand exactly what I am talking about.

    I find it interesting that you state so conclusively that I am repeating “talking points” and spreading “disinformation” without identifying what those are. My argument has been pretty simple all along, sans your unidentified “talking points” or “disinformation.”

    The remainder of your post is nothing more than an off base personal attack that merit no response.

  18. S.V. · April 2, 2012

    @ Nick Farrell,

    The problem is the intentionaly unclear Introduction and your reaction to complaints about it that make it appear you are being dishonest, Mr. Farrell, not the remainder of your book, as my last post explained thoroughly.

    I have not judged the contents of your book. Another deflection, another opportunity to clarify a simple issue sidestepped, another indication of a dishonest motive.

    This discussion has lost its reason, as exemplified by Samuel’s generalized and unsupported rant, and by your refusals to engage the issue directly and deal with it honestly. This is a sign to me that further discussion along these lines is futile.

    Fin.

  19. JNV · April 2, 2012

    Regarding the secret chiefs reference, in my opinion that is the only clear reference to Griffin in the introduction. I take it as an example of a modern order making false claims about itself; an example of modern myth-making. Making obviously false claims, then characterizing every criticism of those claims as an attack is disingenuous at best.

  20. Peregrin · April 2, 2012

    Hi ya,

    I have been away up the country most of the weekend, doing solid practical things and healings etc. Thanks to everyone to their intelligent comments. Yawn to everyone repeating dog muck their leader/Imperator/hurt inner child said. 🙂

    I think the situation here is really clear, and I addressed but a single aspect of David Griffin’s recent weirdness or low cunning (you choose which it is): that of identifying Nick Farrell as, and I quote without cut and pasting:

    “a turncoat posing as Golden Dawn leader to more effectively destroy the Golden Dawn from within.”

    I now see David is saying:

    “I was never implying Nick Farrell is a Fundamentalist Christian. I am saying, however, that the dark specter of Fundamentalism has reared its ugly head in the Golden Dawn community – and that Farrell and others like him are, in reality, Golden Dawn Fundamentalists … ”

    His words however speak for themselves, and no intelligent person will buy this latest take on things.

    In his recent blog post, David refers to the late St Bob (Anton Wilson). However, if David had any understanding of the work of Wilson he and his senior initiates would be presenting vastly different ideas than they do currently.

    The work of Wilson continues today through the Maybe Logic Academy (http://www.maybelogic.org/). The name says a lot, referring to Wilson’s convictions that that using Aristotelian either/or logic in the real world causes much of the world’s harm and problems and the fundamentalist mind-set. Yet this either/or logic, often couched in religious terms, can be found all over David’s blog, urging readers to choose his AO version of the Golden Dawn over others.

    Witness also, GH Fr SR’s use of the blue and red pill metaphor from the Matrix, the need to choose the AO or another way. When on Facebook I suggested choosing neither and going for a purple pill, mixing both, I was shot down and vilified. Poor me 🙂 But it does show that David really does not get the work of Robert Anton Wilson.

    As Nick above says, there are any number of warning alarms that should be sounding for Ros. AO (Griffin redaction) members right now. If they are not, then maybe Maybe Logic needs to be applied 🙂 Thanks.

  21. JNV · April 3, 2012

    Griffin repeats “fundamentalist” 50 times in his latest diatribe.

  22. S.V. · April 3, 2012

    This is my final comment here regarding the subject of this blog, and it is directed to Peregrin’s above statement:

    “Yawn to everyone repeating dog muck their leader/Imperator/hurt inner child said.”

    I, for one, have formed my own opinion, based upon my own reading. My words are my words and my posts are not the result of action without thought. To suggest that I and others are mindless parrots of David Griffin is insulting.

    It is possible that I misconstrued your intent behind your foregoing quoted words, though.

  23. Jacovo · April 5, 2012

    Damn Peregrin! Well said. Bob Wilson would have agreed with you wholeheartedly I am sure. I do not know David Griffin, however he reminds me of a fundamentalist preacher [or Jehovah’s Witness] in that his way is the only way and that if you’re not with him well then you’re going to Hell. Of course all
    above is said, tongue in cheek. I do however believe that he suffers from a serious Messiah complex, and from someone initiated by Patricia Monocris who
    was initiated by Israel Regardie. As much as he hates Regardie [and Crowley]
    he is from that line. He never talks about his initiations and that his lineage came from Regardie [and it did]. So in the end, none of this matters as we all have a direct line to the Secret Chiefs if we work and attain spiritually. No one
    pomp has it all sewed up so that no one else can get in [yet]. I have always liked the philosophy of Sam Webster, to normalize the adept process. David
    Griffin just needs to go back to his mothers teat for a while longer, he was weaned too soon.

  24. Jacovo · April 5, 2012

    One thing you have to admire is the marketing genius of Griffin. With almost 17,000 members at 99. each he is rolling in the dough. He is following the same
    path of Robert Zink in that his members are burdened with huge amounts of material to learn [neophyte over 100 pages]. To what end? The purpose of the
    outer order originally was to empress in the aura each of the elements and to ground that individual in the element while providing them with knowledge that
    they needed to progress to the next grade. It has become an information war designed to keep the frater [soror] in the outer grades. My hope is that more
    people will realize the game that these people are playing and just decide not to
    play. Work done on ones own is just as valid and ardent prayer to ones own
    Holy Guardian Angel over time yields enormous benefits spiritually. Of course
    no one gets your money and for some that is not good. And, ultimately in ten
    years none of this will matter one bit to anyone. Just do the work in silence and let the chips fall where they may. Now, if we could just get David to shut the hell
    up and attend to his order the world would be a better place. Of course his ego
    is not going to allow that. He loves the spotlight too much!

  25. Adastra · April 5, 2012

    Actually nobody has said Nick Farrell is a Christian Fundie. Not at all. What has been demonstrated is the SAME arguments, used in the same way as are common in Christian Fundie attacks on GD. There is a big difference between these two perspectives.

    Farrell’s Witch Hunt is cut from the same cloth in the types of distortion and spin used, and the targets… but that does not necessarily make him a CHRISTIAN Fundie. What he is however is a Recon Fundie.

  26. Peregrin · April 5, 2012

    Hi Ad Astra,

    I think the words, “A definitive pattern has emerged revealing Nick Farrell as a turncoat posing as Golden Dawn leader to more effectively destroy the Golden Dawn from within.”

    and

    ” In any case, only one inescapable conclusion remains – Nick Farrell is a turncoat out to destroy the Golden Dawn. With this in mind, Farrell’s fear-mongering “Golden Dawn Cult” rumors suddenly make sense: Nick Farrell is a trojan horse, that has penetrated into the very heart of the Golden Dawn!”

    and

    “As evidence of the accuracy of these statements, I invite you to read the web page linked here, published by a fundamentalist Christian group called Uncommon Sense Ministries, whose overt purpose is to discredit and destroy the Golden Dawn. Here you will find extremely damning evidence, exposing what Nick Farrell is really up to.”

    Speak for themselves 🙂

    Oh, BTW, do you know ‘Jarek Carnelian’ (Alethia120) ? – Your IP addresses are really similar. Thanks 😉

  27. Baphomet's left nad · April 6, 2012

    butthurt (noun, adjective)

    -Annoyance because of a perceived insult.
    -Upset because of a perceived injustice.
    -David Griffin
    -anyone from David Griffin’s group who posts butthurt comments about Farrell

  28. Pingback: an immense practical advantage: clarity in the midst of confusion « power of language blog: partnering with reality by JR Fibonacci

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